Julian
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Just dropped by to note that the upcoming Joomla 3.0 uses newer technologies such as LESS aside from Bootstrap.
http://lesscss.org/
http://twitter.github.com/bootstrap/
http://community.joomla.org/blogs/community/1671-joomla-30-alpha-2-notes.html
Artisteer fashions itself as "web design software and joomla template maker". Anything less than having the above with the latest release of Artisteer will immediately depreciate its value.
While the above technologies exist as plugins in other CMS, I'm pretty sure it will only be a matter of time when other CMS will follow suit in incorporating them or something similar in their core to fully support responsive and mobile CMS that looks great.
I always visit this site patiently waiting for the next release that hopefully will support Joomla 3.0 and beyond. I will only buy Artisteer if it will support responsive and mobile features as a standard.
Google Analytics shows a huge increase in mobile users. A huge bounce rate occurs for non-mobile, non-responsive websites. Developers and users will patronize a product that is current and not outdated. I hope Artisteer developers understand that clearly.
Julian, Philippines
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Julian
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Hi Tanya
Thank you for your reply.
I can only cross my fingers and hope that this will be addressed properly by the Artisteer developers. If you have a separate team for support and development, I suggest you escalate this to the developers as well.
One thing is very clear when you read the posts in the Artisteer forums:
Support for creation of mobile templates is now a need, not a luxury. For Joomla, support for Bootstrap and LESS is essential. These are core technologies in this mobile CMS to be released about 1 month from now as projected.
Julian, Philippines
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Jonas
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Why joomla 3.0? Wouldn't you rather wait for 3.5?
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Julian
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Hi Jonas
You'll be surprised to know how much one can potentially lose by not
Modifying templates for Joomla 2.5.x from template clubs that are supposed to be "responsive" are just "forced" implementations. I tried that, been there.
The only reason why one will stick with 2.5.x is if they have "existing" sites running on it, and since an auto upgrade path for 2.5.x will not be available until probably a couple of months prior to 3.5 launch, those websites will remain under 2.5.x version for sometime.
Joomla 3.0 will immediately change the ball game for all CMS as we know it. 3.5 will be for another year after 3.0 will be released. If you observe how much you are potentially losing by having a non-mobile CMS or for "forcing" yourself to tweak here and there, you will understand why there will a lot who will construct new websites using 3.0, which is naturally and effectively mobile.
Julian, Philippines
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mightec
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Julian
What I have done is to invest in Jbootsratp from Prieco, http://www.prieco.com/ it is great, have a look at it.
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Julian
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Hi mightec
Thank you for your kind suggestion.
As I understand it, this extension is not going to be part of the Joomla core and the functionalities of JBootstrap will be deprecated when Joomla 3.x is released. Nevertheless I will take a look.
Best Regards
Julian
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mightec
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Julian
I assume that you have seen the recent announcement regarding Joomla 3.0 Alpha-2 release, here is a link.
http://developer.joomla.org/news/536-joomla-3-0-alpha-2-released
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Julian
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Hi mightec
Yes, got a copy myself. Thanks for posting.
I have done a quick study on LESS as well. Quite a fantastic improvement for generating CSS code. Variables (which acts as constants in LESS) are definable and the code gets very clean. If Artisteer incorporates this in their development and gets it right at some point, then their development processes will highly be simplified and release cycles probably faster too. I have seen other CMS themes are also created using this. Joomla is the first to incorporate it as part of the core.
Best Regards
Julian
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Julian
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Hi mightec
Clicked the link you provided, and yes I confirm that I have read this notice weeks back.
Quote: "Joomla 3.0.0 (general availability) is due to be released on or about 26 September 2012.". This is the part that perhaps a lot all looking forward. At least, if you are developing for a new project by that time.
As mentioned earlier, those who have existing 2.5 sites, probably should not upgrade those sites to 3.0, especially an auto-updater (for 3.0) will not be available yet.
Best Regards
Julian
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mightec
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Julian
Yes, it seems to be the case that for the average user, it is best to wait for Joomla 3.5, which I understand is scheduled for September 2013.
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Julian
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Hi mightec
Thank you for your reply.
Not quite, as Joomla 3.0 will definitely be better even for average users for "new projects".
Only those that have "existing Joomla 2.5 websites" should remain using v2.5 and wait until the auto-updater feature becomes available, which will happen probably in version 3.1.
The Long Term Support v3.5 is still far away, and developers with upcoming projects and concerned about mobility cannot wait for that.
Artisteer should be working on this now. More and more are now on mobile on each passing day. Those with non-mobile websites is at the losing end and will definitely have higher bounce rates.
Best Regards
Julian
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jkwebdesign
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No.. you should not use first 3.0 version, even for new sites. If your site is really simple and contains no add-ons, then you can consider 3.0. But even then I would wait 3.0.1 or higher.
3.0 is basically for developers that they have enough time to builds their templates and extensions to support next LT version. There are really no point for artisteer to make it 3.0 compatible, because it is not ready right now. Almost everything changes between 2.5 and 3.0 so I think that there would not be version for 3.0 for a long time. Maybe when 3.1 (6months) or 3.5 (1year) comes. When J1.7 was released artisteer supports it right away but that was totally different. J3.0 is a migration, not an update.
And what I have talked to template club owners, they are not going to update old templates to bootstrap because it is too difficult and time consuming.
There are really no need to start using 3.0 for average people. 3.0 is a nice preview for coming 3.5 but nothing else. Just use 2.5 because it is stable.. you can make it mobile friendly too.
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Chris
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Quote jkwebdesign:
No.. you should not use first 3.0 version, even for new sites. If your site is really simple and contains no add-ons, then you can consider 3.0. But even then I would wait 3.0.1 or higher.
Oh, if it were this simple. You're rather beside the point: Why should one extend a license for a piece of software, when there is no clear statement that future versions of Joomla! will be supported?
Remember that there's a prime charge to produce Joomla! templates - and keep also in mind that what's being introduced in 3.0 will certainly also be there in 3.5.
A clear commitment from Artisteer is more than due.
I have asked first about what's going on here in these boards back in June, and I'm still waiting for an answer.....
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Jonas
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Quote :No.. you should not use first 3.0 version, even for new sites. If your site is really simple and contains no add-ons, then you can consider 3.0. But even then I would wait 3.0.1 or higher.
Actually agree with jkwebdesign. Ultimately "Designers" should wait for 3.5 considering how all the J! dev cycle works. I'm not sure I agree with Chris, since the final changes committing to 3.5 will not necessarily be the same seen in 3.0. Sticking to 2.5 till then.
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jkwebdesign
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You really should Wait 3.5.. and there are no rush.. there are a year before it launches and there will be one release between those (3.1). And you should remember that 2.5 is lts version and It have 1, 5 year support promised.
You really cant wait that someone tell you that they will support all future releases.. nobody knows what is coming year later..
And it is not sure that something introduced in J3.0 will be same in J3.1 or in the next LTS version (J3.5). Joomla is growing very fast..
I think that it would be enough that artisteer supports only LTD releases.. it would be really difficult to make all the changes every 6th month. Sometimes it will be easy but example now it will be really difficult (integrating bootstrap is like making all from ground).
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David
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The main reason most people will want to move to Joomla 3.0 is its mobile features.
I dont think it would be appropriate to wait till Joomla 3.5 to start focusing on mobile or a responsive site in "BUSINESS WISE"
if Artisteer can add a responsive feature to Artisteer 4.0, i think this will help curb the number of people rushing to Joomla 3.0
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Julian
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To wait for Joomla 3.5 means there is really no point in releasing a 3.0 version. Tell that to the Joomla development team. Better, just give Artisteer developers a reason why they "can" think to simply get away with it.
Read articles made by Joomla team. All references to "staying" with Joomla 2.5.x pertains to "existing" websites running that version.
What is the value of Artisteer then for existing websites running Joomla 2.5? Perhaps not zero, but significantly diminished. As developers, how often do you "recreate" a design for an existing website? How many of your customers will pay for that? What is your ratio for "redesign an existing project" against "design for a new project"?
If Joomla 3.0 is released and Artisteer does not support it, the value of Artisteer will only be about 10% only. This is a 90% huge potential loss!
You only need Artisteer for new development projects, not for existing websites!
That is the point.
Best Regards
Julian
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Jonas
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Quote :To wait for Joomla 3.5 means there is really no point in releasing a 3.0 version.
Actually, 3.0 seems more the "experimental" phase if you will. What works ultimately to integrate for the long haul in 3.5. For whatever reason 2.5 would be the equivalent of Photoshop CS5, and 3.5 will be the CS6. Unlike most other software which releases on the *.0, Joomla has seemed to made it more confusing by making *.5 the official supported release. Saying that Artisteer MUST release for J! 3.0 is like saying that you want BF4 Beta. An incomplete tool for a very tester platform.
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jkwebdesign
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I can´t understand why this is so confusing for many people..?
You should not use J3.0 if you can avoid it, it´s that simple! You can make mobilefriendly website without it if you need it. J3.0 is mostly for developers and for those who wanna be a "beta" tester
ALWAYS USE LTS VERSION IF YOUCAN!
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Julian
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Hi jkwebdesign
Quote: "ALWAYS USE LTS VERSION IF YOUCAN!"
You can always avoid shouting you know.
You seem not reading the Joomla! documentations to come to such a preposterous conclusion. It seems you are more confused than anyone here.
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Jose
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Resurrecting an old post ;)
J 3.0 is already the recommended version by J! itself for new sites...
I disagree about waiting for 3.5, I think developers should focus to have their products up for X.0 because taht is the phase they are gonna be tested!
All extensions should be compatible with X.1 (that's first stable short term support)
Why? well for me makes no sense to wait for an extension to work in an stable better piece of software, I will consider using another
Also, I have to test your extension when I already have a stable site? I do have to wait until you fix your product and get stable as the software? I don't think so, testing version is for that, to test and adapt yourself to the changes... I know alpha and beta are not best phases to do so, but RC is already feature closed, and X.0 is final, all changes are to fix things, nto to change how it works... waiting for X.5 is in my opinion poor support for your users, poor planification, and little interest to improve your product, waiting until is inevitable...
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Brian Craigie
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The Bootstrap functionality is not working with Artisteer 4.2.0.60623 yet this post implies it would be supported.
How do I make my template Bostrap-enabled?
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Eileen
Artisteer Team
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Artisteer has its own responsive framework so bootstrap may be not needed.
Joomla Bootstrap settings shouldn't effect Artisteer template, if you encounter any related issue I would recommend that you contact Artisteer support and describe the issue in more details.
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Webguy
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Joomla 3.X runs on bootstrap, or supports it, Artisteer templates do not, they use their own as you have just said, when you get something like Hikashop that required Bootstrap to be responsive, it does not work at all.
I tried the addon that includes bootstrap, but that does not appear to be compatible with J3.X.
I need to get bootstrap working with artisteer templates so that Hikashop can be responsive, so any suggestions appreciated.
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Rick Sunchez
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As much as I like to play games, I am the kind of person who immerses myself in the atmosphere of games very easily, and I often get stuck there for a long time. How do you feel about games? Do you think they are bad or are there those who won your heart?
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Tony SHvalts
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When I decided for myself that I would become a developer, I did not know that so many difficulties would appear on my way. I recently found a post https://thewiredshopper.com/cross-platform-games-everything-you-need-to-know/ that told me about what I have to do at the development stage. Now there are many platforms for games and you need to make a choice which platform will be, if you want a lot, you will have to optimize for each.
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Jackson
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http://www.artisteer.com/
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